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By WinterIsComing
#482733 Despite Johnnie's shortcomings as LU spokesman/PR guy (not entirely his fault imho), I'm extremely glad to see that he has used his experiences at LU to become a spokesman on this troubling and disturbing geopolitical/religious issue. Feel free to move this to the ISIS and Russia thread if you so desire.

http://www.glennbeck.com/2015/03/18/the-islamic-state-is-targeting-christians-in-the-middle-east-and-these-americans-are-doing-something-about-it/

http://www.glennbeck.com/2015/04/23/should-americans-be-afraid-of-isis/
By WinterIsComing
#482734 He also just wrote a book on the topic, with an emphasis on the Christian persecution taking place.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0718039599/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0718039599&linkCode=as2&tag=glennbeckcom-20&linkId=55CMF74FM7ABUUA3
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By Sly Fox
#544104 The latest buzz around Johnnie from WaPo:

Washington Post wrote:Acts of Faith
‘Walking a line’: The shrewd tactics of the White House’s evangelical gatekeeper

By Michelle Boorstein and Sarah Pulliam Bailey January 8 at 7:43 AM

Image
Johnnie Moore, unofficial spokesman alor President Trump’s group of evangelical advisers, in front of the Trump International Hotel in Washington. (Bill O’Leary/The Washington Post)


As Israel has shot to the top of President Trump’s agenda, world leaders have looked for the perspective of one of Trump’s biggest and most reliable voting blocs. And Johnnie Moore, the White House’s evangelical gatekeeper, has been there to provide it.

Moore, a wunderkind PR executive, has served through the Trump candidacy and presidency as the shepherd for many conversations between Trump aides and conservative evangelical leaders who, like Moore, consider the Jewish state — and the status of Jerusalem in particular — to be at the top of their priority list. At 34, Moore has been consulted about the topic at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. and at private meetings with Arab leaders. He was in the Oval Office a few weeks ago for a private ceremony honoring Trump for saying the United States officially considers Jerusalem the capital of Israel.

For evangelicals, “those who bless Israel will be blessed,” Moore said he tells White House officials.


Click Here for Full Story
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By Purple Haize
#544109 The fact Evangelicals apparently need a ‘Gatekeeper’ is something I find disturbing
By cruzan_flame13
#544129
Purple Haize wrote:The fact Evangelicals apparently need a ‘Gatekeeper’ is something I find disturbing



Of course it's disturbing; look at the paper who wrote this piece lol
By WinterIsComing
#544238 Different times and/or situations, but I feel one could argue Jerry Falwell Sr. (and in some cases Jr.) was/is the gatekeeper. Not saying that's a good thing, but would anyone care to discuss the pros and cons and unique subtleties between Johnnie, Sr, and Jr? I haven't fleshed this out myself, but would enjoy others perspectives.
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By Purple Haize
#544243
WinterIsComing wrote:Different times and/or situations, but I feel one could argue Jerry Falwell Sr. (and in some cases Jr.) was/is the gatekeeper. Not saying that's a good thing, but would anyone care to discuss the pros and cons and unique subtleties between Johnnie, Sr, and Jr? I haven't fleshed this out myself, but would enjoy others perspectives.


I’m going to say No. I am opposed to the concept of ‘Gatekeepers’ when it comes to giving your Faith Bona Fidel’s. But I’ve never run for National Office. You want my credentials? Go see the Pastor of the Church I attend.
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By Jonathan Carone
#544247 I’m not the biggest Johnnie Moore fan, and I’m definitely not a Trump fan, but there’s something to be said about finding things you agree on and then working towards those things. This idea that we have to agree on everything in order to work together towards a common goal is one of the biggest issues we are facing today.
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By jbock13
#544249 Usually when liberal papers call someone a “conservative kingpin”, it’s someone I nor anyone else has heard of.
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By Purple Haize
#544254
jbock13 wrote:Usually when liberal papers call someone a “conservative kingpin”, it’s someone I nor anyone else has heard of.


Whenever I hear ‘kingpin’

By thepostman
#544258
Jonathan Carone wrote:I’m not the biggest Johnnie Moore fan, and I’m definitely not a Trump fan, but there’s something to be said about finding things you agree on and then working towards those things. This idea that we have to agree on everything in order to work together towards a common goal is one of the biggest issues we are facing today.


I can agree with that idea but I think that you also must stand up for certain things. You can't just not confront certain issues because it may make you feel uncomfortable. That is basically what Johnny Moore is doing. The quote below just rubbed me the wrong way and is the source of this response.


The Senate race in Alabama and Christian nationalist Roy Moore? “I’m not involved.” Trump’s penchant for lying? “I don’t want to get into it. Because I don’t focus on those things.” The GOP tax law that bitterly divided religious leaders? “I don’t think there’s an answer.”

“For me, that’s all noise,” he said. “It’s not that it isn’t important, but I don’t have time for all that. . . If I did dig into it, I might have stronger opinions, and that would be a distraction for me.
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By Jonathan Carone
#544259 I actually appreciated that response from him. He has a focus and knows what's important to him and he goes after that. I don't expect every person to be well versed on every issue, especially someone in Johnnie's position. I'd much rather have that response than have someone toe a party line or try to fake it.
By thepostman
#544260 I guess you and I are reading it differently. Not wanting to be bothered by the fact someone may not have integrity enough to be truthful is troublesome to me. I'm not asking him to fake it but I also don't want him to ignore it either. Things like integrity seems like important things for someone who is suppose to be a "religious gatekeeper". I don't think that is a fair description of his role but that is probably another discussion.

This may also go back to the deep rooted issues I have with how so many Christians have justified Trump's terrible behavior. But again I don't disagree that we should focus more on what what issues we agree on and work on those things but the issues I have with the President aren't necessarily political. I understand to many on this board that shouldn't be a focus but for me it is and I don't see that changing any time soon.
By Yacht Rock
#544263 As a PR guy, he should know that there are many ways to answer that question even if you don’t “follow it closely.” The reality it seems though is that most Christian responses that would likely impugn the act of lying may result in him feeling the wrath of Trump and having his access revoked.
By JK37
#544285
thepostman wrote:so many Christians have justified Trump's terrible behavior.


I don’t believe this is a true statement, at least the way I read it. Every Christian I know detests the detestable things he has done. Voting for or supporting him where he can be agreed with does not justify the other things on which one disagrees. So I’m wondering if by supporting anything he does, you’re saying Christians are inherently supporting everything he does? Or if by saying nothing publicly about the detestable, you infer support?
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By Jonathan Carone
#544286 In today’s climate, rightly or wrongly, if you support one piece of something and then stay quiet on other pieces of that same thing, it’s assumed you’re still supporting the thing. If I like Chick Fil A and don’t comment on the Cathy’s view of homosexuality then I agree with them. If I like Trump’s view on immigration and don’t comment on his sexual issues then I’m okay with them. That’s the world we live in and mainstream Christianity has not adapted to that well because they don’t believe it to be true and in the process has lost credibility with a lot of people.
By thepostman
#544287 I didn't say all Christians who voted for Trump justified his terrible behavior because many have not but there are plenty of people who claim to be Christians instead of simply acknowledging he isn't that great of a guy will attempt to make the moral shortcomings he have not seem so bad. I have seen articles written, I have heard Jerry Falwell Jr do it, I have had conversations with friends who do it and I have seen people on this board do it.

At least PH doesn't try to paint Trump as some kind of saint. But many people do and that is what is so frustrating for me to watch.

I'm not sure if I am making sense but hopefully I am getting my thoughts acorss as well as I would like.

On a side note Chic Fil A is delicious so people are willing to overlook anything they may disagree with the founder on. Maybe Trump should create something so delicious to bring America together :)
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By Purple Haize
#544290
thepostman wrote:I didn't say all Christians who voted for Trump justified his terrible behavior because many have not but there are plenty of people who claim to be Christians instead of simply acknowledging he isn't that great of a guy will attempt to make the moral shortcomings he have not seem so bad. I have seen articles written, I have heard Jerry Falwell Jr do it, I have had conversations with friends who do it and I have seen people on this board do it.

At least PH doesn't try to paint Trump as some kind of saint. But many people do and that is what is so frustrating for me to watch.

I'm not sure if I am making sense but hopefully I am getting my thoughts acorss as well as I would like.

On a side note Chic Fil A is delicious so people are willing to overlook anything they may disagree with the founder on. Maybe Trump should create something so delicious to bring America together :)


Yeah, the World is jacked up when I’m the voice of reason. :D

I voted for Trump because I support his policy positions. He was running for an office to implement said policies. I would have no issues explaining why is personal life choices were not in line with mine as easily as I would my boy Mitt. But those choices are irrelevant and not disqualifying for Office.
I am absolutely amazed at the eagerness to run with half baked stories to disprove Trump and what passes for ‘news’. Who knew eating Big Macs was an impeachable Offense and evidence of the 25th Amendment? W got hammered by the Press. Obama got eviserated by the Right wing fringe but fawned over by the Mainstream Media. Has there been more then one or two stories about Trump that are positive NOT run by Hannity? It’s absolutely amazing.
Anyways, I’ll defend his Policies and his record because that’s what is important. I like his Tweetering because half the time he’s baiting or taking the heat off someone else. He likes heat you know. He’s not the Stateman President. But if you didn’t know that going in you should by now!
Carry on
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By Sly Fox
#544291 As someone in the PR space who trains and consults spokespersons, this discussion is not one I would expect to see on this board. But I like it.
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By Purple Haize
#544292
Sly Fox wrote:As someone in the PR space who trains and consults spokespersons, this discussion is not one I would expect to see on this board. But I like it.


We should probably shut it down. :D
By thepostman
#544294 I know I often focus on the issues I have with Trump when I post here but that is mostly because the majority who post on here are Trump supports but I have just as many issues, if not more, with the anti Trump crowd.

It seems to me that conservative media makes it seem Trump can do no wrong and the MSM believe Trump can not do anything right. Then again with Obama it was the other way around. And if someone comes on one of those networks with opposing views they get talked over and talked down to. It's just an infuriating time in history.
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By makarov97
#544315
Jonathan Carone wrote:In today’s climate, rightly or wrongly, if you support one piece of something and then stay quiet on other pieces of that same thing, it’s assumed you’re still supporting the thing. If I like Chick Fil A and don’t comment on the Cathy’s view of homosexuality then I agree with them. If I like Trump’s view on immigration and don’t comment on his sexual issues then I’m okay with them. That’s the world we live in and mainstream Christianity has not adapted to that well because they don’t believe it to be true and in the process has lost credibility with a lot of people.


With respect, think about what you wrote there. You started off with "rightly or wrongly." You end with a premise that "mainstream Christianity" must somehow adapt to this.

Frankly, that's nonsense. The fact that the world operates in illogical, obtuse, and doltish terms does not mean that we have to accept it, entertain it, or modify our behavior or actions to accommodate it.

Patronizing millennial snowflakes has caused this problem. Christianity doesn't have to adapt to the world, the world needs to adapt to Christianity.

What is right is right, what is wrong is wrong.

It's really that simple.
By Yacht Rock
#544316
makarov97 wrote:
Jonathan Carone wrote:In today’s climate, rightly or wrongly, if you support one piece of something and then stay quiet on other pieces of that same thing, it’s assumed you’re still supporting the thing. If I like Chick Fil A and don’t comment on the Cathy’s view of homosexuality then I agree with them. If I like Trump’s view on immigration and don’t comment on his sexual issues then I’m okay with them. That’s the world we live in and mainstream Christianity has not adapted to that well because they don’t believe it to be true and in the process has lost credibility with a lot of people.


With respect, think about what you wrote there. You started off with "rightly or wrongly." You end with a premise that "mainstream Christianity" must somehow adapt to this.

Frankly, that's nonsense. The fact that the world operates in illogical, obtuse, and doltish terms does not mean that we have to accept it, entertain it, or modify our behavior or actions to accommodate it.

Patronizing millennial snowflakes has caused this problem. Christianity doesn't have to adapt to the world, the world needs to adapt to Christianity.

What is right is right, what is wrong is wrong.

It's really that simple.


Would it were so simple.

Arguing truth and right from a Biblical perspective is not always the popular political path. Sometimes scripture is more in line with something a liberal is trying to do and sometimes it’s more in line with what a conservative is trying to do. God doesn’t fit into the box of absolutes. The problem is that many Christian’s try to serve two masters (the master of political ideology and God) and we know how that ends.

This is absolutely something we as Christians should challenge ourselves with.
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By makarov97
#544318
Yacht Rock wrote:
makarov97 wrote:
Jonathan Carone wrote:In today’s climate, rightly or wrongly, if you support one piece of something and then stay quiet on other pieces of that same thing, it’s assumed you’re still supporting the thing. If I like Chick Fil A and don’t comment on the Cathy’s view of homosexuality then I agree with them. If I like Trump’s view on immigration and don’t comment on his sexual issues then I’m okay with them. That’s the world we live in and mainstream Christianity has not adapted to that well because they don’t believe it to be true and in the process has lost credibility with a lot of people.


With respect, think about what you wrote there. You started off with "rightly or wrongly." You end with a premise that "mainstream Christianity" must somehow adapt to this.

Frankly, that's nonsense. The fact that the world operates in illogical, obtuse, and doltish terms does not mean that we have to accept it, entertain it, or modify our behavior or actions to accommodate it.

Patronizing millennial snowflakes has caused this problem. Christianity doesn't have to adapt to the world, the world needs to adapt to Christianity.

What is right is right, what is wrong is wrong.

It's really that simple.


Would it were so simple.

Arguing truth and right from a Biblical perspective is not always the popular political path. Sometimes scripture is more in line with something a liberal is trying to do and sometimes it’s more in line with what a conservative is trying to do. God doesn’t fit into the box of absolutes. The problem is that many Christian’s try to serve two masters (the master of political ideology and God) and we know how that ends.

This is absolutely something we as Christians should challenge ourselves with.


I disagree. Without God, there cannot be ANY absolutes. Without absolutes, there can be no objective truths. Without absolute objective truth, there is NO truth, and what feels right becomes the be all and end all for defining morality. Truth is absolute because God is absolute truth. Truth is absolute because it is derived from the King of Kings, Lord of Lords, the one and only God. The fact that the world does not want to acknowledge absolute truth does not make it (or God) any less real.
By Yacht Rock
#544321 I’m talking about the divisions people put themselves in these days. Mostly political absolutes. God doesn’t fit into our absolutes. Of course yes, He has absolute truth.
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By Purple Haize
#544326 Which is why it’s not really possible to call someone God’s candidate. Or vice versa.
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By Class of 20Something
#544327
Purple Haize wrote:Which is why it’s not really possible to call someone God’s candidate. Or vice versa.


Cept Jesus. :D
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By jbock13
#544337 I think the issues is there's two sides of the issue: There's one side that tries to appease and apologize for Christians who stand up for what they believe in because they didn't say it the most eloquent manner, or quibble over the slightest details of a statement. On the other hand, there's the side of Christians who will defend anything anyone who claims to be a Christian says (Roy Moore debacle is the best example of this). I feel like both sides signal just a bit too strongly.
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By jbock13
#544338
Yacht Rock wrote:Sometimes scripture is more in line with something a liberal is trying to do and sometimes it’s more in line with what a conservative is trying to do.


With all due respect, I don't see how this is the case. Of course I'm not implying that everything conservative is what God would want us to do, but the pro-life issue sticks out the most in my mind.
By Yacht Rock
#544345
jbock13 wrote:
Yacht Rock wrote:Sometimes scripture is more in line with something a liberal is trying to do and sometimes it’s more in line with what a conservative is trying to do.


With all due respect, I don't see how this is the case. Of course I'm not implying that everything conservative is what God would want us to do, but the pro-life issue sticks out the most in my mind.


That’s what I’m talking about though. When it comes to the unborn, conservatives typically show more grace than liberals. However, there are some issues where the liberals act more Christlike than conservatives.

I don’t think Jesus fits nicely into a box of conservative vs. liberal.

He’s Jesus. We should try to put ourselves in His box instead of trying to force him into ours.
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By jbock13
#544347 If I may just give an example, let’s pick charity. Most conservatives are very generous with contributions privately made to charity. But the majority of liberals would argue it is the governments job to force people to contribute to their social causes by way of taxation. Which is morally superior?
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By jbock13
#544348
thepostman wrote:Republicans aren't pro life.


Of course. Most conservatives are. :D
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By jbock13
#544349
Jonathan Carone wrote:So the only thing liberals care about is abortion?


Not sure how you drew that conclusion from my statement.
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By Jonathan Carone
#544350
jbock13 wrote:
Jonathan Carone wrote:So the only thing liberals care about is abortion?


Not sure how you drew that conclusion from my statement.


jbock13 wrote:
Yacht Rock wrote:Sometimes scripture is more in line with something a liberal is trying to do and sometimes it’s more in line with what a conservative is trying to do.


With all due respect, I don't see how this is the case. Of course I'm not implying that everything conservative is what God would want us to do, but the pro-life issue sticks out the most in my mind.


You basically said liberals couldn't be more in line with Scripture than conservatives at any point purely because of their pro-choice views.
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By jbock13
#544353 I was implying that it is one example. Just one.
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By Purple Haize
#544355 Do you (Generic not pointed at anyone) expect your Political Leaders to also be Spiritual Leaders? Do You (Generic) expect your Spiritual Leaders to be Political Leaders?
By Yacht Rock
#544356 I think you may have missed the point. Conservatives don’t have a monopoly on Christlike behaviors at all. Neither do Liberals. I think many times, in a rush to defend ones Conservative argument or Liberal argument or Republican argument or Democrat argument, people forget they should argue from the perspective of a Christian first. Even if that means going against the tide of conservative or liberal waters. I’ve seen many people on this board tie themselves in knots trying to defend both personal behaviors and policies simply because someone has an R next to their name.
By thepostman
#544375 I don't expect politicians to be super Christians but I do expect politicians who claim to be Christians to at least attempt to act that way.

Trump has claimed he is a Christian since he began this presidential run and has told so many lies it's just insane. But he is old so maybe he just doesn't realize he is lying.

Unfortunately the MSM spent so much time pissing on George W Bush their attacks on Trump is just white noise to many conservatives.
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By Purple Haize
#544389
thepostman wrote:I don't expect politicians to be super Christians but I do expect politicians who claim to be Christians to at least attempt to act that way.

Trump has claimed he is a Christian since he began this presidential run and has told so many lies it's just insane. But he is old so maybe he just doesn't realize he is lying.

Unfortunately the MSM spent so much time pissing on George W Bush their attacks on Trump is just white noise to many conservatives.


Is hyperbole lying?
By Yacht Rock
#544424
Purple Haize wrote:
thepostman wrote:I don't expect politicians to be super Christians but I do expect politicians who claim to be Christians to at least attempt to act that way.

Trump has claimed he is a Christian since he began this presidential run and has told so many lies it's just insane. But he is old so maybe he just doesn't realize he is lying.

Unfortunately the MSM spent so much time pissing on George W Bush their attacks on Trump is just white noise to many conservatives.


Is hyperbole lying?


If the matter can be subjective, then I'd say possibly not, but if it's an objective topic, I'd say it's lying. I've seen a lot of dishonesty on both subjective and objective matters from Trump, so he's not someone I'd trust with much in this world.
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By Purple Haize
#544427
Yacht Rock wrote:
Purple Haize wrote:
thepostman wrote:I don't expect politicians to be super Christians but I do expect politicians who claim to be Christians to at least attempt to act that way.

Trump has claimed he is a Christian since he began this presidential run and has told so many lies it's just insane. But he is old so maybe he just doesn't realize he is lying.

Unfortunately the MSM spent so much time pissing on George W Bush their attacks on Trump is just white noise to many conservatives.


Is hyperbole lying?


If the matter can be subjective, then I'd say possibly not, but if it's an objective topic, I'd say it's lying. I've seen a lot of dishonesty on both subjective and objective matters from Trump, so he's not someone I'd trust with much in this world.


With Trump, like any Politician, you take what they say with a grain of salt. Being he comes from a Marketing background and was/is very successful at it, i couch all he says as hyperbole wrapped around a kernel of fact. And I’m ok with that.
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By Purple Haize
#544434
thepostman wrote:But I thought he wasn't like all the other politicians....


He isn’t.
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By Purple Haize
#544439
thepostman wrote:I don't agree and never have agreed with that. It's all genius marketing but it's not at all accurate.


You think he’s like every other Politician? Huh.