If you want to talk ASUN smack or ramble ad nauseum about your favorite pro or major college teams, this is the place to let it rip.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke

By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#652034
ACC favored basketball over football. That’s why they loved those four at the time. It’s like nobody learned from the old Big East.

The fact that the ACC literally has one hard copy of the GoR’s, and will not allow them outside the building, is both hilarious and fascinating to me. Lawyers have to travel in person to the conference office to study them, and are prohibited from removing them or making copies.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#652035
ballcoach15 wrote: February 24th, 2023, 9:49 pm No west coast school belongs in ACC. ACC used to be good conference, but it got watered down with addition of Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Louisville and Notre Dame. Those schools brought nothing to the conference. ACC needs to return to days of Clemson, FSU and VT carrying the flag for football, and UNC and Duke carrying flag for basketball. Baseball and softball continues to be strong.
Syracuse and Louisville have a National Championship in hoops
Notre Dame has a national title or two in football I believe
And
VT was in the Metro Conference at one point.
So in using your “Logic” Louisville ND and Syracuse bring more to the ACC then VT brought
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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#652044
Yes, the power brokers of the ACC agreed to the terms of that ridiculously long grant fo rights to preserve a conference that was in a worse predicament than the Pac-12 finds itself right now. They invented the concept of the GoR and ratified before everyone really had an opportunity to understand the full implications.

Yes, it kept Tobacco Road intact. But it was based on the old school concept of ACC basketball being the premier league that could carry the fortunes of its members in spite of football. But we have seen several leagues pass the ACC up for top dog and their bets on Miami and Louisville helping their football cause have never truly materialized. So here they stand with a contract that pays half what their peers are getting today and potential a quarter of what it will be paying their peers in the final years of this ESPN/ACC Network contract.
By flamehunter
Registration Days Posts
#652054
Sly Fox wrote: February 25th, 2023, 10:47 am Yes, the power brokers of the ACC agreed to the terms of that ridiculously long grant fo rights to preserve a conference that was in a worse predicament than the Pac-12 finds itself right now. They invented the concept of the GoR and ratified before everyone really had an opportunity to understand the full implications.

Yes, it kept Tobacco Road intact. But it was based on the old school concept of ACC basketball being the premier league that could carry the fortunes of its members in spite of football. But we have seen several leagues pass the ACC up for top dog and their bets on Miami and Louisville helping their football cause have never truly materialized. So here they stand with a contract that pays half what their peers are getting today and potential a quarter of what it will be paying their peers in the final years of this ESPN/ACC Network contract.
Am I somewhat correct in thinking that the room full of power brokers were mostly of the same mindset as our beloved ballcoach?
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By tyndal23
Posts
#652059
IF ( and a big IF) Forbes report that just broke - PAC and ACC exploring a merger - that would put Big 12 behind the 8 ball to expand. My old “ write a big check and take a long rev share deferment” move could have some legs. Their report includes SMU and SDSU as part of the new conference. That leaves USF,Memphis,Boise, Tulane,ECU, Fresno St., UConn as our competition to get a seat. I don’t see how we could without a dramatic proposal that most of these other schools couldn’t or wouldn’t “Offer”.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#652074


The ACC should call Florida states bluff on this one. Taking Florida states share and splitting across the other 13 members for the next 15 years helps close the gap for awhile.
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#652079
tyndal23 wrote: February 25th, 2023, 2:58 pm IF ( and a big IF) Forbes report that just broke - PAC and ACC exploring a merger - that would put Big 12 behind the 8 ball to expand. My old “ write a big check and take a long rev share deferment” move could have some legs. Their report includes SMU and SDSU as part of the new conference. That leaves USF,Memphis,Boise, Tulane,ECU, Fresno St., UConn as our competition to get a seat. I don’t see how we could without a dramatic proposal that most of these other schools couldn’t or wouldn’t “Offer”.
ACC/Pac10 ...... would be the biggest conference in the country, 26 teams across all four time zones with historical success in all major sports.

https://duckswire.usatoday.com/lists/ca ... ence-idea/
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#652082
ballcoach15 wrote: February 27th, 2023, 11:40 am ACC should have nothing to do with PAC 12. ACC constantly digs their own grave.
The Raycom, Pilot Life, Piedmont Airline, Mid-Atlantic model is long gone BC. I think we're looking at a P4 very soon. All 4 need east/west conferences for the new model. TV $$$
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By Ill flame
Posts
#652085
https://www.si.com/fannation/college/cf ... 12-schools

There are new reports that there are big ten officials looking into adding Washington, Oregon, Stanford and Cal. I can understand adding Washington and Oregon to help reduce travel for the LA schools but Stanford and especially Cal are dead weight and bring less to the table than Rutgers. I hope these reports have no credibility.
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By cruzan_flame13
Posts
#652086
Ill flame wrote: February 27th, 2023, 7:32 pm https://www.si.com/fannation/college/cf ... 12-schools

There are new reports that there are big ten officials looking into adding Washington, Oregon, Stanford and Cal. I can understand adding Washington and Oregon to help reduce travel for the LA schools but Stanford and especially Cal are dead weight and bring less to the table than Rutgers. I hope these reports have no credibility.
BIG added Maryland and I suppose their basketball program gave weight then. Now not so much now. Money and prestige talks more than anything else, especially in the BIG.
By ATrain
Registration Days Posts
#652087
TH Spangler wrote: February 27th, 2023, 1:10 pm
ballcoach15 wrote: February 27th, 2023, 11:40 am ACC should have nothing to do with PAC 12. ACC constantly digs their own grave.
The Raycom, Pilot Life, Piedmont Airline, Mid-Atlantic model is long gone BC. I think we're looking at a P4 very soon. All 4 need east/west conferences for the new model. TV $$$
At this point, its looking like it'll be the P2, with the Big XII stuck between the B1G/SEC and everyone else.
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By LUOrange
Posts
#652089
I've never believed Cal and Stanford would be left hanging. It seems that the PAC12 being divided among the B12 and the B10 is the most likely outcome. The question remains is what happens with OR State and WA State? Do they go to the B10, B12 or MWC? Or do they poach other schools for a new PAC12 in order to keep the Conference autonomy? Then more importantly, how does this trickle down to us?
Last edited by LUOrange on February 28th, 2023, 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#652091
Just keep in mind, that any MWC institutions that leave that league are going to owe roughly $16M in exit fees. That's not pocket change for the likely schools that would align with Wazzu & Oregon State. And it is not like there is some big pile of money sitting on the table left behind for WSU/OSU outside of tourney credits. They can't even negotiate a decent media deal with everyone still on board today. Perhaps the tourney credits would be enough to tempt the upper echelon MWC schools like SDSU, Boise, Fresno, Air Force & Colorado State to team up and leave some of the MWC riffraff behind. At that point then you'd likely see the Montana schools and the Dakota States head toward the MWC along with perhaps UTEP & NMSU.

Bottom line, the Pac would essentially become the AAC of the West.

It is not entirely out of the realm of possibilities that Stanford & Cal could go Indy in football with the regionally friendly and hoops heavyweight WCC in everything else for a period of time if the rest of the league collapses around them. They both still are both enough of a draw to schedule well particular with likeminded P5 schools. Now that would be a disastrous outcome for both of those schools athletically. But I am just throwing some hypotheticals out there.

It is very clear that the haves & have nots in the ACC are drawing battle lines with over a dozen years left on their existing Grant of Rights. Leadership at both FSU & Clemson has been public in demanding weighted revenue-sharing in order to maintain membership in the league. Honestly the fact that both of those schools went public within just days is not a coincidence. There clearly is something afoot to challenge the GoR in court and perhaps lawyers at both schools feel they might have a winner. Of course leadership at UVa & UNC have to be quietly cheering on the southern rivals. If the GoR is broken in court, then all heck breaks loose to form the two super-conferences.

Frankly Liberty is not ready for the free-for-all until we get our academic issues resolved. Yes, we have resources and moderate athletic success. But we still have the Junior stains on us as well as they complete lack of academic credibility in our current most senior positions. If we can those issues finally addressed, then we will be ready for serious discussions to rise to higher realms of the college sports ladder perhaps with the Big XII or ACC leftovers.
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By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#652093
Yeah, LU was hoping the GoR would hold longer, giving time to get ready. LU should be rooting for it the challenge to fail in court or the uneven revenue sharing to be implemented.

LU needs time more than anything else, or they’re going to be left out of the next game of musical chairs.
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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#652095
All of this movement is happening to quickly for us. Keep in mind that leagues tend to have a short term memory when they hastily react to a massive market shift. Our hoops team making a nice run the next couple of weeks would certainly be helpful should spots open up above us.

Everything right now is predicated on whether or not the new Pac-12 commish can convince his league to hold together. The ACC situation is likely going to take awhile longer to work out.

ESPN holds nearly all the cards these days in the Southern college football landscape with the ACC in their grasp until 2036 at bargain basement prices. How they choose to pressure the ACC and SEC leaders could ultimately decide the fates of the ACC haves. I ponder whether they would rather keep UVa & UNC in-house than risk them heading up the B1G where they would be a value add to that league held by Fox, CBS & NBC.

And let me add how great it is to know we have the right AD in place to manage these troubled waters. Incidentally his replacement in Waco has been making his own waves today directed toward Pac 12 schools that the Big XII might be targeting. These discussions have typically always been behind closed doors. Not so in 2023.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#652097
There's no doubt more realignment is coming soon. The question is when and how much. If we are a few years down the road with a few conference championships and R2 status under our belt I would welcome the chaos but right now realignment isn't likely to help us. Best case scenario for us now is for the pac 12 to add SDSU and SMU and that be the end of realignment for a few years. I'm not convinced that the big ten will do anything right now, especially considering they don't have a commissioner but we know they aren't finished. I feel like the 2.5 years under prevo was a missed opportunity to be in a much better position but there's no use crying over spilled milk.
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#652098
Ill flame wrote: February 27th, 2023, 7:32 pm https://www.si.com/fannation/college/cf ... 12-schools

There are new reports that there are big ten officials looking into adding Washington, Oregon, Stanford and Cal. I can understand adding Washington and Oregon to help reduce travel for the LA schools but Stanford and especially Cal are dead weight and bring less to the table than Rutgers. I hope these reports have no credibility.
Stanford and Cal bring academics and history that Rutgers didn't bring. Academics matter a great deal to the Big Ten, and bringing in the #1 public university in the world according to the News and World Report Rankings along with the #3 University in the world overall in Stanford would be a boon to the Big Ten's academic prestige.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#652100
stokesjokes wrote: February 28th, 2023, 1:59 pm
Ill flame wrote: February 27th, 2023, 7:32 pm https://www.si.com/fannation/college/cf ... 12-schools

There are new reports that there are big ten officials looking into adding Washington, Oregon, Stanford and Cal. I can understand adding Washington and Oregon to help reduce travel for the LA schools but Stanford and especially Cal are dead weight and bring less to the table than Rutgers. I hope these reports have no credibility.
Stanford and Cal bring academics and history that Rutgers didn't bring. Academics matter a great deal to the Big Ten, and bringing in the #1 public university in the world according to the News and World Report Rankings along with the #3 University in the world overall in Stanford would be a boon to the Big Ten's academic prestige.
I hate that you're right. Maybe I should rephrase and say they don't bring anything to the athletic side of the conference. Rutgers added tangible tv value by giving the conference leverage to get the BTN into NJ and NY. NYC was also the city with the most Big ten alumni outside of their footprint. There are plenty of big ten fans in the bay area and it's a big market but nobody in that market cares which is evident from the pac 12s recent struggles finding a tv partner. Adding those two teams only reduce the per school payouts while also being irrelevant in the revenue sports.
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By Ill flame
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#652133


This is the tv ratings for each ACC, PAC12 and Big 12 program. I was suprised UNC is so low and Washington state was so high on this list. Based on this the ACC should be in the best position of the three but Florida state and Clemson are in the mood to burn the whole conference to the ground.
By ATrain
Registration Days Posts
#652134
Well considering what the B1G, SEC, and Big XII schools are getting in terms of money, I don't necessarily blame FSU and Clemson. This long term deal the ACC signed clearly didn't anticipate the dramatic growth in revenues or the NIL era in general, nor did it consider that the SEC and B1G would go after more Big XII and PAC-10/12/whatever members. Hindsight being 20/20, the ACC's deal was a knee jerk reaction to Maryland leaving without giving thought to the future.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#652138
I'm curious if the SEC would even take either program right away if they could get out of the GORs soon. I'm sure South Carolina and Florida would lobby hard against either program joining and it doesn't bring new markets to the SEC network. The league has had plenty of opportunities to take either school over the years and yet they remain in the ACC. Either FSU and Clemson have already contacted the SEC and know they have a home there in the future or they are playing a very dangerous game of chicken with the ACC. The big ten won't take them and the other P5s can't offer anymore than the ACC can.
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