If you want to talk ASUN smack or ramble ad nauseum about your favorite pro or major college teams, this is the place to let it rip.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke

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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#654727
That implies the fraudulent practices of Swofford to entice ACC schools to enter GoR under false pretenses. That will likely be a long, legal battle. Otherwise the Grant of Rights makes this all wishful thinking for some ACC schools wishing to escape.

I am not sure that B1G values Clemson enough to offer. But FSU & Miami might be another story.
User avatar
By Ill flame
Posts
#654730
It's very unlikely the B1G will take Clemson or Florida state. It's an academic alliance first that shares a ton of resources and an athletic conference second, since those schools don't have AAU status B1G presidents won't be interested. Georgia tech, Miami, UNC and /UVA are the most common B1G additions out of the AAC since they have AAU status and cover large markets.

B1G presidents were also firmly against the west coast expansion despite Kevin Warren's best efforts and finally put their foot down after the UCLA/USC additions. That along with how he handled covid put a bad taste in the presidents mouth which is why the writing was on the wall he was going to leave the conference one way or another. I do think the B1G will expand again once their tv rights are up but I would be suprised if they do before then. The presidents don't seem to have an appetite for it despite certain speculation from the media.
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By tyndal23
Registration Days Posts
#654732
Ill flame wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 10:10 am It's very unlikely the B1G will take Clemson or Florida state. It's an academic alliance first that shares a ton of resources and an athletic conference second, since those schools don't have AAU status B1G presidents won't be interested. Georgia tech, Miami, UNC and /UVA are the most common B1G additions out of the AAC since they have AAU status and cover large markets.

B1G presidents were also firmly against the west coast expansion despite Kevin Warren's best efforts and finally put their foot down after the UCLA/USC additions. That along with how he handled covid put a bad taste in the presidents mouth which is why the writing was on the wall he was going to leave the conference one way or another. I do think the B1G will expand again once their tv rights are up but I would be suprised if they do before then. The presidents don't seem to have an appetite for it despite certain speculation from the media.
If that is the case, then OR and WA will go Big 12 ( only 2 teams that Fox will kick in for above 14 ). Still have to see it to believe it, but looking much more likely. That leaves PAC 6 as
OSU
WSU
Cal
Stanford
Utah
ASU

An even worse streaming deal from Apple without WA / OR

And 11 MW teams to pick from Co St, SDSU ( can they afford the buyout ? ) UNLV, Fresno St ( academics? ) Boise St ( academics ? ). Tulane, SMU - is it even worth leaving AAC for them ( more $ but streaming and a shaky conference long term ) What a mess !!!
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By Ill flame
Posts
#654735
tyndal23 wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 2:00 pm Ah, here it is...knew BIG can’t pass up OR/WA at least getting to a vote by the Presidents.

I'll believe it when I see it. These same rumors were being reported months ago but the B1G presidents were clearly not interested. From the B1G perspective nothing has really changed.

This statement is basically the same thing the b1G has been saying for awhile.
By tyndal23
Registration Days Posts
#654736
LU might be P5 after all - without buying in...probably get in for free to the PAC 4 now. Just offer to cover travel expense for the west coast teams - ha.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#654737
tyndal23 wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 5:20 pm LU might be P5 after all - without buying in...probably get in for free to the PAC 4 now. Just offer to cover travel expense for the west coast teams - ha.
Stanford and Cal would go independent before sharing a conference with us.
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By cruzan_flame13
Posts
#654738
Ill flame wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 5:25 pm
tyndal23 wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 5:20 pm LU might be P5 after all - without buying in...probably get in for free to the PAC 4 now. Just offer to cover travel expense for the west coast teams - ha.
Stanford and Cal would go independent before sharing a conference with us.
The modern day "Chaldeans" don't want to be aligned with those who are foreign or perceived as "less"to them? How so sad :lol:
By ATrain
Registration Days Posts
#654739
AP reporting that the B1G is having conversations about more expansion "if PAC-12 crumbles." Essentially USC doesn't want any more West Coast schools, but the B1G has looked at Stanford, Cal, Washington, and Oregon before landing USC and UCLA. Oregon and Washington are currently center stage, but Stanford is being considered as a potential lure to get Notre Dame.

The writing is on the wall for the PAC-12, the question is whether or not the B1G will take Stanford and Cal with Oregon and Washington. The rest of the Corner 4 to the Big 12 is a matter of when. Oregon State and Washington State are in the worst position right now.

https://apnews.com/article/pac12-big-te ... eac895dd2e

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... nstability
User avatar
By LUOrange
Registration Days Posts
#654741
ATrain wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 8:04 pm AP reporting that the B1G is having conversations about more expansion "if PAC-12 crumbles." Essentially USC doesn't want any more West Coast schools, but the B1G has looked at Stanford, Cal, Washington, and Oregon before landing USC and UCLA. Oregon and Washington are currently center stage, but Stanford is being considered as a potential lure to get Notre Dame.

The writing is on the wall for the PAC-12, the question is whether or not the B1G will take Stanford and Cal with Oregon and Washington. The rest of the Corner 4 to the Big 12 is a matter of when. Oregon State and Washington State are in the worst position right now.

https://apnews.com/article/pac12-big-te ... eac895dd2e

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... nstability
When does the PAC# lose it's Power/autonomous status? Cause what stops OSU & WSU from taking the best & brightest programs from the MWC & AAC and essentially becoming the CUSA of the P5?
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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#654743
Now is a great moment for us all to catch our collective breath. The events of the next few days will all have direct implications on multiple decisions that could go any number of directions. And let me blunt, the timing of all of this is not in our favor.

Pac-12
Let's start where all the attention is focused at the moment. The illusion that this P5 couldn't die is now gone. I think everyone now expects that the remainder of the Four Corners schools are destined for the Big XII and that Washington & Oregon will likely be out as well. The latter two could be possibly headed at reduced rate to B1G or possibly join the 4C schools in Big XII. Regardless of where they go, that leaves the Pac with the following schools:

Cal
Stanford
Oregon State
Washington State


It is possible that Stanford & Cal get a life raft to one of the above leagues. It is also possible the two schools go indy in football and park other sports in Big West. But essentially you willfind the Pac left in a lonely scenario. But,But ... A5 status? Am I right? Well, that is not an iron-clad situation. But what about all of the exit fees the remaining schools will be collecting from the dpeartures of USC/UCLA and the rest? There are no exit fees in the Pac-12. But at least they would have a television contract, right? That's how they got in this mess in the first place.

That leaves tow paths moving forward for the Pac-12: Expansion or Extinction. Honestly I am not sure which is more likely. But either path will have similar impacts in the realignment landscape. The Pac could take the best of the MWC and perhaps even a few random AAC schools and move forward, This is a likely scenario from my perspective. Think of it as a glorified Mountain West. There is also the possibility that the Pac & MWC could straught up merge exisitng assets. That is a legitimate possibility andlikely would result in the least amount of dominoes falling out of the west.


Mountain West
Assuming that the MWC is only pillaged by whatever is left of the Pac, they will likely be looking torestock with a few teams as well. The obvious choices in their current footprint would be CUSA brethren UTEP & NMSU. I don't see them adding the Dakota States or Montanas simply because there isn't enough revenue to spread around the league. I also believe that it is unlikely that any AAC schools bolt due to excessive exit fees and little ROI on the moving costs. But it is possible.

It is also possible that commissioner Gloria Narvaez' public acknowledgements a few months ago that the league would like to expand east to be more attractive to future television deals could have some substance. How far east? San Marcos, Texas ... Memphis... Tampa .... West Point? Could mean something or absolutely nothing. If there is buzz about MWC for the Flames in some random conversations over the next few days, this would be the driver. But I findthis to be a highly unlikely scenario.


AAC
Let me be clear, this is purely speculation and there is a strong possibility that this could have no connection to reality. But this is where things could potentially get more interesting east of the Mississippi. If no one from the league ispached by either the Pac or MWC, then I don't see much happening here. But the likelihood that at least SMU and possibly as many as 5-6 other schools could get cherry-picked based on events above, it could get very interesting. Frankly I don't see this scenario playing out. But if it did, a much-depleted AAC would start to come into play for us. Why? Let's look at their potential candidates that could be poached without major economic impacts:

  • Army - Indy
  • Georgia State - SBC
  • Texas State - SBC
  • La Tech - CUSA
  • MTSU - CUSA
  • UConn - Indy/Big East
  • UMass - Indy/A10
  • Western Kentucky - CUSA


Army has declined a much healthier AAC lineup for decades. Even the potential slotting for 12-team playoff was not enough to entice them. So scratch West Point. Georgia State and Texas State are the most likely candidates. Both fit the large market/major enrollment profiles that AAC commish Arresco has favored in past expansions. It couldbe argued that both schools would probably feel better in the Belt at this stage. Texas State would likely be the first expansion choice for the MWC ... if they were interested. Knowing the culture of the Lone Star State, the Bobcats likely feel a much greater affinity toward being aligned with schools to the east as opposed to the west. Then what you have left are the northeastern indies and the rest of the CUSA pieces. Among the CUSA schools available, MTSU makes the most sense in the Nashville market with a track record of not being embarassing.

But then you look around and realize that in spite of not even technically having played a second in CUSA yet, that we might actually have the best facilities, resources and frankly functional setting for the AAC to plug and play ... anything is possible. Once again, we have at least turned the corner with new leadership in place for a full month. We have removed the stigma have finally been invited to an FBS league. We have demonstrtated our ability to compete on and off the field at that level. While I still believe it is unlikely at this moment in time for us to get the AAC call, it wouldnt be insanity from either the league or school's perspective.
By AATL
Posts
#654748
LUOrange wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 9:40 pm Can anyone confirm or deny the Twitter rumors of WKU & UMASS to the MAC and UTEP & NMSU applying for membership to the MWC?
Their local beat writer seems to think it's far from official.
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By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#654750
College sports are being destroyed by realignment, NIL and Transfer Portal. The Bible says the love of money is the root of all evil. No where is this more true than within the NCAA. Sports should be about playing the game and trying to win a trophy.

The NCAA is so badly run, it makes Congress look good. Very weak leadership at NCAA Headquarters.
Last edited by ballcoach15 on August 3rd, 2023, 8:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#654754
We are on the verge of P2 + M2 + G5/6:

P2:
B1G & SEC

M2:
Big XII & ACC

G5/6:
Pac/MWC, AAC, SBC, MAC, CUSA

The gap between P2 and everyone else is widening by the second. The Big XII is clearly establishing itself as the 3rd strongest league ahead of the ACC but is FAR behind the B1G & SEC in revenue and consolidation of power.

++++

This morning we are MUCH closer to resolution on where things are headed than we have been in months.

WKU/Umass - I get the feeling that WKU is much less enthusiastic about the MAC than they were last summer. Having the CUSA media deal in place with additional nearby members steals their enthusiasm from purely survival instincts. UMass has been there, done that with the MAC. Neither party valued the experience.

UTEP/NMSU - Yes, they are gone if the opportunity arises. The MWC is well aware of their interests so no applications needed. I think the odds that UTEP leaves is exceptionally high in hecoming weeks. NM State is substantially lower. Both would disappointing for the long term stability of CUSA. Neither would be devastating to our position.
User avatar
By prototype
Registration Days Posts
#654755
Sly Fox wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 9:21 am We are on the verge of P2 + M2 + G5/6:

P2:
B1G & SEC

M2:
Big XII & ACC

G5/6:
Pac/MWC, AAC, SBC, MAC, CUSA

The gap between P2 and everyone else is widening by the second. The Big XII is clearly establishing itself as the 3rd strongest league ahead of the ACC but is FAR behind the B1G & SEC in revenue and consolidation of power.

++++

This morning we are MUCH closer to resolution on where things are headed than we have been in months.

WKU/Umass - I get the feeling that WKU is much less enthusiastic about the MAC than they were last summer. Having the CUSA media deal in place with additional nearby members steals their enthusiasm from purely survival instincts. UMass has been there, done that with the MAC. Neither party valued the experience.

UTEP/NMSU - Yes, they are gone if the opportunity arises. The MWC is well aware of their interests so no applications needed. I think the odds that UTEP leaves is exceptionally high in hecoming weeks. NM State is substantially lower. Both would disappointing for the long term stability of CUSA. Neither would be devastating to our position.
Sad - we are quickly moving back to being a FCS team again (Not officially, but might as well be considered a lower level again). After all we did to fight to be included in FBS.... Colleges have lost confidence in NCAA and conferences offer so much more opportunites to make cash and still play against Big Boys...
User avatar
By Ill flame
Posts
#654757
prototype wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 9:53 am
Sad - we are quickly moving back to being a FCS team again (Not officially, but might as well be considered a lower level again). After all we did to fight to be included in FBS.... Colleges have lost confidence in NCAA and conferences offer so much more opportunites to make cash and still play against Big Boys...
Starting next year if we win our games we will play an elite P5 in the CFP. That doesn't feel FCS to me.
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User avatar
By prototype
Registration Days Posts
#654758
Ill flame wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 10:45 am
prototype wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 9:53 am
Sad - we are quickly moving back to being a FCS team again (Not officially, but might as well be considered a lower level again). After all we did to fight to be included in FBS.... Colleges have lost confidence in NCAA and conferences offer so much more opportunites to make cash and still play against Big Boys...
Starting next year if we win our games we will play an elite P5 in the CFP. That doesn't feel FCS to me.
For now. The bigger these conferwences get - the more power they obtain and things change quick... I hope we dominate our conference and win a bunch of games - really put pressure on conferences to seek us out.
By tyndal23
Registration Days Posts
#654760
prototype wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 10:48 am
Ill flame wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 10:45 am
prototype wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 9:53 am
Sad - we are quickly moving back to being a FCS team again (Not officially, but might as well be considered a lower level again). After all we did to fight to be included in FBS.... Colleges have lost confidence in NCAA and conferences offer so much more opportunites to make cash and still play against Big Boys...
Starting next year if we win our games we will play an elite P5 in the CFP. That doesn't feel FCS to me.
For now. The bigger these conferwences get - the more power they obtain and things change quick... I hope we dominate our conference and win a bunch of games - really put pressure on conferences to seek us out.
Yes, for 2 years and then the new CFP will eliminate auto bids.
By tyndal23
Registration Days Posts
#654762
LUOrange wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 9:38 pm
ATrain wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 8:04 pm AP reporting that the B1G is having conversations about more expansion "if PAC-12 crumbles." Essentially USC doesn't want any more West Coast schools, but the B1G has looked at Stanford, Cal, Washington, and Oregon before landing USC and UCLA. Oregon and Washington are currently center stage, but Stanford is being considered as a potential lure to get Notre Dame.

The writing is on the wall for the PAC-12, the question is whether or not the B1G will take Stanford and Cal with Oregon and Washington. The rest of the Corner 4 to the Big 12 is a matter of when. Oregon State and Washington State are in the worst position right now.

https://apnews.com/article/pac12-big-te ... eac895dd2e

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... nstability
When does the PAC# lose it's Power/autonomous status? Cause what stops OSU & WSU from taking the best & brightest programs from the MWC & AAC and essentially becoming the CUSA of the P5?
Don’t be shocked if it is only 2 taken and OR isn’t one of them...then OR to Big 12 and preferably ASU is stuck in PAC and Utah goes Big 12. Big 12 is giving OR all the time they need - hopefully Utah catches up on process and forces Big 12 to consider them over ASU ( which brings nothing to the table other than a tv market where no one cares about ASU and a good travel partner for non football) Utah brings academics/research $ and great football and loyal fan base. AZ will come to Big 12 with or without ASU.
By tyndal23
Registration Days Posts
#654763
tyndal23 wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 12:07 pm
LUOrange wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 9:38 pm
ATrain wrote: August 2nd, 2023, 8:04 pm AP reporting that the B1G is having conversations about more expansion "if PAC-12 crumbles." Essentially USC doesn't want any more West Coast schools, but the B1G has looked at Stanford, Cal, Washington, and Oregon before landing USC and UCLA. Oregon and Washington are currently center stage, but Stanford is being considered as a potential lure to get Notre Dame.

The writing is on the wall for the PAC-12, the question is whether or not the B1G will take Stanford and Cal with Oregon and Washington. The rest of the Corner 4 to the Big 12 is a matter of when. Oregon State and Washington State are in the worst position right now.

https://apnews.com/article/pac12-big-te ... eac895dd2e

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... nstability
When does the PAC# lose it's Power/autonomous status? Cause what stops OSU & WSU from taking the best & brightest programs from the MWC & AAC and essentially becoming the CUSA of the P5?
Don’t be shocked if it is only 2 taken and OR isn’t one of them...then OR to Big 12 and preferably ASU is stuck in PAC and Utah goes Big 12. Big 12 is giving OR all the time they need - hopefully Utah catches up on process and forces Big 12 to consider them over ASU ( which brings nothing to the table other than a tv market where no one cares about ASU and a good travel partner for non football) Utah brings academics/research $ and great football and loyal fan base. AZ will come to Big 12 with or without ASU.
And I agree with Sly about AAC poaching due to buyouts. Much better chance GK gets fired and Cal,ASU, WA St., OR State merge with MW under PAC 12 umbrella but with current MW as Commish ( she runs circles around GK ). Which medium term is best for LU. It keeps a P5 ( however weakened ) alive and with a seat at the table for CFP votes and next round of realignment - which buys time for cable model to continue to die and streaming to become more and more relevant and new $ and time and opportunity for an LU to grow in to consideration for a weak P5 Conference.
User avatar
By Ill flame
Posts
#654764
tyndal23 wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 11:30 am
prototype wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 10:48 am
Ill flame wrote: August 3rd, 2023, 10:45 am

Starting next year if we win our games we will play an elite P5 in the CFP. That doesn't feel FCS to me.
For now. The bigger these conferwences get - the more power they obtain and things change quick... I hope we dominate our conference and win a bunch of games - really put pressure on conferences to seek us out.
Yes, for 2 years and then the new CFP will eliminate auto bids.
They added an autobid for the top g5 in part because they were afraid of lawsuits. I don't see that changing.
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